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9 minutes ago, frogtwang said:

 

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Euron, pointless. White horse into the sunset, come on really?  We waited 2 years for this? What a let down. 

 

Spoiler

I believe the white horse was symbolic of the little girl who Arya couldn't save, even though she tried. That little girl was holding a white horse with red-stained legs every time she was shown. In the shot of the mother/little girl's charred bodies, they hold the camera on the horse for several seconds.

 

I'll give you Euron, though. I really hope he's good and dead.

 

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Episode 3 should have been the finale. The show started with the White Walkers, should end with the White Walkers.

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7 hours ago, frogtwang said:

 

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Episode 3 should have been the finale. The show started with the White Walkers, should end with the White Walkers.

 

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Spoiler

And would have if they hadn't spent season 7 running around doing everything except taking Kings Landing.

 

 

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Maybe the fault all lies with Martin for not finishing his books and letting the TV people write their own story.

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I guess I wasn't as down on the episode as others.  I think in some ways, the writers are in an impossible situation where few people will be satisfied no matter what they do ... I think in many ways they are doomed by the ridiculous success of the show.

 

I think they partially corrected my complaint from two weeks ago in that ...

 

they killed off some main characters in some unpredictable (at least for me) ways.  They explicitly set up Cersei's murder/assassination by the hand of Arya/Jamie and turned that on it's head.  They set up Cersei having the upper hand militarily and turned that on its head. 



 

And I think this season they have tried to fix the problems of season 6 where character development flew out the window.  A little humanity being restored to Arya (and, to a much lesser extent, Cersei at the very end), fleshing out Breanne as not completely an automaton.  Spending a considerable amount of time letting the characters interact outside of the battles.

 

All of which said, makes my main complaint all the more galling:

 

For the life of me, I don't understand why the writers/showrunners insisted on shortening these last two seasons.  I think a lot of what I haven't liked is the result of trying to cram so much into fewer episodes.  First and foremost, Dany's descent into madness seems rushed and unearned.  Yes, the elements have always been there ... she has horrifically killed people at least once in every season ... but in those cases, you felt like you understood how she thought she was justified in meting out such terrible justice.  The fact that they crammed all the "betrayal" that supposedly sent her over the edge into one episode (Missandei's death and Jon/Sansa/Tyrion/Varys spreading Jon's secret), was an unforced error that could have been corrected by letting that betrayal evolve over several episodes.



 

I agree that the white horse bit was some clichéd symbolism. And I am also glad Euron is dead.

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22 minutes ago, Duquesne Frog said:

All of which said, makes my main complaint all the more galling:

I read last week that HBO was pushing for more episodes years ago and the writers said something to the effect of, "We've always seen this as a 73 episode story." Ludicrous. They were done with this project in their heads a long time ago.

 

Spoiler

I HATED the Jaime ending. Why even show the Brienne hook up and him momentarily conflicted about leaving her? Then he tells Tyrion that he doesn't care about the innocents that will be killed? Jaime got the Kingslayer moniker because he killed the king who was going to kill the innocents! Jaime had seven and a half seasons of redemption with Brienne to come to this crap? If Brienne comes up pregnant, that will be the death of the entire series for me. Oh, and the Euron fight doesn't make sense at all, not because he happens to wash up out of the sea precisely where Jaime is walking into the cave, but because why fight? I guess because Euron's an ass, that's the only reason I can come up with. I really hope he did die, even though we didn't see it.

 

Some of it I didn't mind. Varys did what he had always said he would do, protect the realm. I am anxious to know who his letters went to and why he removed his rings (they won't tell us this, I'm sure). He died a good death. I could understand Grey Worm's rage. I enjoyed Clegane Bowl, RIP Hound. Loved Qyburn's death, that was pretty good. Cersei was defiant throughout the battle, as she would be, but she finally showed fear when she realized it was all going to come down around her ears (literally). I thought all the actors did an outstanding job. The production was great. The CGI was mostly great (the initial rush into the gates after Drogon torched them was the only time on my initial watch I though it looked fake). But, as Duq said, the rush to get Dany into Mad Queen required too much of a leap. When you were looking from Cersei's POV out on the city to see Drogon laying down fire like it was coming out of a water hose, that was way over the top. And, the bells, Bells, BELLS! My gosh, if they had mentioned the dang bells one more time I would have looked for Septa Unella to come out ringing her bell from the black cell Cersei must still have had her in. They made it out to be the bells making Dany go crazy, but in reality she saw the castle that was taken from her family and it make her snap. But, the casual fan didn't know that until the episode recap by D&D after the show. Just another example of the writing being so sloppy this season.

 

I'm counting on George not to die before getting those last two books out. At least one book, please, George. The character arcs have got to be better than this.

 

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34 minutes ago, PurpleDawg said:

I read last week that HBO was pushing for more episodes years ago and the writers said something to the effect of, "We've always seen this as a 73 episode story." Ludicrous. They were done with this project in their heads a long time ago.

 

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I HATED the Jaime ending. Why even show the Brienne hook up and him momentarily conflicted about leaving her? Then he tells Tyrion that he doesn't care about the innocents that will be killed? Jaime got the Kingslayer moniker because he killed the king who was going to kill the innocents! Jaime had seven and a half seasons of redemption with Brienne to come to this crap? If Brienne comes up pregnant, that will be the death of the entire series for me. Oh, and the Euron fight doesn't make sense at all, not because he happens to wash up out of the sea precisely where Jaime is walking into the cave, but because why fight? I guess because Euron's an ass, that's the only reason I can come up with. I really hope he did die, even though we didn't see it.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, Jamie/Euron was pure plot device.  They needed someone to kill Euron.  But why not just let Drogon fry him?


I guess I wasn't as turned off by the Jamie arc, however.  He was too complicated a character to have been fully redeemed.  He's a guy who bore 3+ children with his sister, killed and maimed countless people to keep that secret.  Phuked up by his sociopathic family-obsessed father.  And ultimately, while he may have been motivated in killing the Mad King by saving the innocents, he probably also recognized that no one (including himself) was safe under the Mad King, and ultimately (if he had that foresight, probably not) his action put his (future) children/nephews in line for the Iron Throne.  It would have been too fantasy-myth-ish to have him totally reformed at the end.  He was always a messed up dude.

 

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I think I'm most upset because it's like Brienne became Jaime's Winterfell sidepiece. There was no mention of her at all in episode 5, even from Tyrion who congratulated Jaime the previous episode for being happy with her. She was just totally forgotten. B has been reduced to a plot device for J to try out being happy without Cersei. All that work through the seasons on the J/B relationship for him to not even say he cares for Brienne when he leaves her. He just says he's addicted to his sister. Totally out of character for what he had become.

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Speaking of HBO series winding down, anybody watching Veep this season?  Man, they went dark with this season.  It's always been cynically funny, but I guess the writers felt like the cynicism in the era of Trump had to be ramped up a level to make the show more than just another Trump-based-satire. 

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Well, this is impressive at least.

 

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10 hours ago, Duquesne Frog said:

I guess I wasn't as down on the episode as others.  I think in some ways, the writers are in an impossible situation where few people will be satisfied no matter what they do ... I think in many ways they are doomed by the ridiculous success of the show.

 

I think they partially corrected my complaint from two weeks ago in that ...

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

they killed off some main characters in some unpredictable (at least for me) ways.  They explicitly set up Cersei's murder/assassination by the hand of Arya/Jamie and turned that on it's head.  They set up Cersei having the upper hand militarily and turned that on its head. 

 


 

And I think this season they have tried to fix the problems of season 6 where character development flew out the window.  A little humanity being restored to Arya (and, to a much lesser extent, Cersei at the very end), fleshing out Breanne as not completely an automaton.  Spending a considerable amount of time letting the characters interact outside of the battles.

 

 

 

All of which said, makes my main complaint all the more galling:

 

 

  Hide contents

For the life of me, I don't understand why the writers/showrunners insisted on shortening these last two seasons.  I think a lot of what I haven't liked is the result of trying to cram so much into fewer episodes.  First and foremost, Dany's descent into madness seems rushed and unearned.  Yes, the elements have always been there ... she has horrifically killed people at least once in every season ... but in those cases, you felt like you understood how she thought she was justified in meting out such terrible justice.  The fact that they crammed all the "betrayal" that supposedly sent her over the edge into one episode (Missandei's death and Jon/Sansa/Tyrion/Varys spreading Jon's secret), was an unforced error that could have been corrected by letting that betrayal evolve over several episodes.

 

 

 

Spoiler

They do seem to be rushing to the finish, and yet we had that scene where the Night King and Brandon were just staring at each other while the minutes ticked away. This week Arya was running and dodging falling buildings, running and dodging, running and dodging for a ridiculous amount of screen time. They needed to do episodes of at least 150 minutes, then edit them down to 90 minutes of real story. Actually, it seems like they didn't have an editor at all this season.

 

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18 hours ago, Duquesne Frog said:

Speaking of HBO series winding down, anybody watching Veep this season?  

 

I thought this season was great.  The whole storyline with Jonah running for president was hilarious.

 

Barry is the best show on HBO right now.

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4 hours ago, Lyle Lanley II said:

 

I thought this season was great.  The whole storyline with Jonah running for president was hilarious.

 

I've always loved that show.  The only season I wasn't that into was the last one where she was out of office, trying to cement her legacy.  Something about there not being any real stakes for Selina made it not click for me.

 

I tried watching The Thick of It (the British precursor) and had trouble getting into it. 

 

4 hours ago, Lyle Lanley II said:

Barry is the best show on HBO right now.

 

I've watched 3-4 episodes of season 1 and have liked it.  Not in love with it yet, but still into it enough that I'm making progress.

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Mrs. Zebe and I finished getting caught up on GOT in time to watch tonight’s finale live.  Now we can start watching all the shows we normally watch that are on our dvr.

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Spoiler

Ghost got Jon back -- all is well.

 

Also, Drogon survived, Brienne put Jaime's story in the histories, Sam gets to read a lot of books as Grand Maester, and Arya is off on adventure. All good. Not sure how Bronn as Master of Coin will work out, probably will be a well-deserved headache for Tyrion.

 

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10 hours ago, Zebra Frog said:

Mrs. Zebe and I finished getting caught up on GOT in time to watch tonight’s finale live.  Now we can start watching all the shows we normally watch that are on our dvr.

Wow, that's some bingeing.

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2 hours ago, Burner said:

 

Wow, that's some bingeing.

Yep.  At least 1 hour a night, sometimes 2, and at least 3 on the Sat/Sun.  She ended up loving the show and after it was over said that she would miss it not being on.  I will miss the gratuitous nudity/violence.  😀

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On 5/16/2019 at 7:36 AM, Duquesne Frog said:

Started watching Chernobyl last night ... gonna be a tough watch.

 

Yep.  Really, really uncomfortable and scary - but so well done.  

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2 hours ago, Zebra Frog said:

Yep.  At least 1 hour a night, sometimes 2, and at least 3 on the Sat/Sun.  She ended up loving the show and after it was over said that she would miss it not being on.  I will miss the gratuitous nudity/violence.  😀

If Mrs. Z is a book reader, she might try out the book series now that she's seen the TV show. They are far superior to what was on TV. Hoping GRRM can get the last two published sometime in the next several years.

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She is but not interested in reading that book. Next in her list is Howard Stern's new book. 

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